Originally Posted by Mowicz

I don't know why, but I feel like the motivation for this is a bit off.

If I was going to try and influence people and show them what I believe is the 'correct' way to live, or introduce new alternatives to them, I wouldn't start out by declaring everything they were doing is wrong...that just screams street-corner preacher to me.

I like my meat, and perhaps I'm not the healthiest individual on campus, but I'm sure I could make healthier choices and still enjoy my red meat. Exercise more, try to enjoy leaner alternatives...So the question is, what motivation do I have to buy into this? From reading the initial post, it just kind of turned me off of the idea.

The initial post did outline a lot of good benefit for leaning toward the vegetable side. It does sound like a total bash on meat and I can understand you being turned off as a result.

Out of those points, which one did you disagree with the most?

One key feature of focusing more on vegetables is that it is more environmentally friendly. The points were listed on the original post.

People don't realize how much government funding goes into growing meat. That is the only reason why it is even affordable. As a result, I disagree with the whole "saving your wallet" point. Going all fruits and vegetables actually cost more.

Originally Posted by Mowicz

I don't know why, but I feel like the motivation for this is a bit off.

If I was going to try and influence people and show them what I believe is the 'correct' way to live, or introduce new alternatives to them, I wouldn't start out by declaring everything they were doing is wrong...that just screams street-corner preacher to me.

I like my meat, and perhaps I'm not the healthiest individual on campus, but I'm sure I could make healthier choices and still enjoy my red meat. Exercise more, try to enjoy leaner alternatives...So the question is, what motivation do I have to buy into this? From reading the initial post, it just kind of turned me off of the idea.

There are plenty of delicious dishes offered at Bridges (some of the best on campus imo). Maybe you could host get-togethers in Bridges (or another pre-selected veggie location that changes week to week so it doesn't get boring) where interested people can shoot the breeze and get to know each other. If that happened, I'd definitely be more inclined to attend and give the whole meat-less thing a try.

But as it stands now, and no offense to any vegetarians here, it just makes me want to bust out the barbecue and fry up a huge steak.

You make a good point, but health reasons are sometimes what it takes to draw people to a vegetarian lifestyle. The premise behind a vegetarian/ vegan lifestyle is to avoid speciesism, but many people can't grasp that/refuse to. Vegetarian "recruiters" (couldn't think of a better word to describe someone who is trying to convince someone that the veggie way of life is the way to go) sometimes have to work with the whole "Me Me and only Me" attitude some people have and hope that, by embracing the vegetarian lifestyle purely for health reasons will help the person understand other concepts that are central to a vegetarian life style as well.

Note: I'm not trying to say that meat eaters are selfish human beings, just that it's easier to convince someone to do something when it directly benefits them.

Originally Posted by AelyaS

You make a good point, but health reasons are sometimes what it takes to draw people to a vegetarian lifestyle. The premise behind a vegetarian/ vegan lifestyle is to avoid speciesism, but many people can't grasp that/refuse to. Vegetarian "recruiters" (couldn't think of a better word to describe someone who is trying to convince someone that the veggie way of life is the way to go) sometimes have to work with the whole "Me Me and only Me" attitude some people have and hope that, by embracing the vegetarian lifestyle purely for health reasons will help the person understand other concepts that are central to a vegetarian life style as well.

Note: I'm not trying to say that meat eaters are selfish human beings, just that it's easier to convince someone to do something when it directly benefits them.

Personally, I completely disagree with the "don't eat animals because they're living creatures too" mantra. A lot of animals eat other animals: it's just a way of life. I respect those who do it, but I definitely don't feel the same way.

The health benefits and the environmental concerns of today are really the only reasons I'd go back to veganism.

Originally Posted by alh24

Personally, I completely disagree with the "don't eat animals because they're living creatures too" mantra. A lot of animals eat other animals: it's just a way of life. I respect those who do it, but I definitely don't feel the same way.

The health benefits and the environmental concerns of today are really the only reasons I'd go back to veganism.

Definitely agree with this.

• REDUCE HEART DISEASE
  Beans, peas, nuts and seeds contain little to no saturated fats. Reducing saturated fats can help keep your cholesterol low, and cut risk of cardiovascular disease.
• LIMIT CANCER RISK
  Hundreds of studies suggest that diets high in fruits and vegetables can reduce cancer risk. Red meat consumption is associated with colon cancer.
• FIGHT DIABETES
  Research suggests that plant-based diets – particularly those low in processed meat – can reduce your risk of type 2 diabetes.
• CURB OBESITY
  People on low-meat or vegetarian diets have significantly lower body weights and body mass indices. A plant-based diet is a great source of fiber (absent in animal products). This makes you feel full with fewer calories, ie. lower calorie intake and less overeating.
• LIVE LONGER
  Red and processed meat consumption is associated with increases in total mortality, cancer mortality and cardiovascular disease mortality.
• IMPROVE YOUR DIET
  Consuming beans or peas results in higher intakes of fiber, protein, folate, zinc, iron and magnesium with lower intakes of saturated fat and total fat.

Wtf is all this? Propaganda? Seriously have you people ever heard of a thing called moderation? People have been surviving on meat for many years, and all of a sudden meat is going to kill you and give you cancer? No, people kill their bodies because they cant control their portions. Anything in excess is bad for you. Information like this is unacceptable in a university. Provide sources for all this information or remove it. Its an exactly credible to provide information on how bad meat is from a meatless monday website.Ugh. Besides the only reason meat in North America is bad is because we mass produce everything, we feed cows and pigs with chemicals so they grow faster. Obviously that will kill people sooner.

Originally Posted by alh24

Personally, I completely disagree with the "don't eat animals because they're living creatures too" mantra. A lot of animals eat other animals: it's just a way of life. I respect those who do it, but I definitely don't feel the same way.

The health benefits and the environmental concerns of today are really the only reasons I'd go back to veganism.

For a lot of people though, it's not so much the actual consumption of meat, but rather the means by which the meat was obtained. Organic meat is an option people should look into.

When it comes to health benefits, to be honest, the only time the idea of being a vegetarian purely for health benefits seems legitimate is if you're someone who's basically a carnivore. I know many omnivores who are at optimal health. I think it was PHLN who said it, but moderation is key.

And oh my God, what is with people assuming that all vegetarians are skinny. I know fat vegetarians.

Originally Posted by AelyaS

For a lot of people though, it's not so much the actual consumption of meat, but rather the means by which the meat was obtained. Organic meat is an option people should look into.

When it comes to health benefits, to be honest, the only time the idea of being a vegetarian purely for health benefits seems legitimate is if you're someone who's basically a carnivore. I know many omnivores who are at optimal health. I think it was PHLN who said it, but moderation is key.

And oh my God, what is with people assuming that all vegetarians are skinny. I know fat vegetarians.

I know a lot of average/heavy vegetarians, but the only vegans I know are relatively thin or lean. Once you have to cut out 95% of junk food because almost all of it contains some form of milk or cheese, you're not left with much to put a lot of extra weight on you.

The only reason I brought it up is because I think vegetarian (and related) organizations generally have this type of problem.

As an example, PETA has completely turned me off of the whole concept mentioned above (the animals are living creatures and we shouldn't eat them thing). I try to keep an open mind when it comes to different philosophies, but I can't help but look at the people preaching and see if I have any reason to listen to them in the first place. In PETA's case, there have been many examples of vigilante justice, and a lot of the funds they raise go to court costs and bail. Without even looking at their philosophy itself, I can't sympathize with a group like that.

While the initiative is fine in principle, I don't want you guys to inadvertantly come off the wrong way...that's all. And not to compare you to PETA or anything, just a fitting example.

Originally Posted by AelyaS

And oh my God, what is with people assuming that all vegetarians are skinny. I know fat vegetarians.

Originally Posted by alh24

I know a lot of average/heavy vegetarians, but the only vegans I know are relatively thin or lean. Once you have to cut out 95% of junk food because almost all of it contains some form of milk or cheese, you're not left with much to put a lot of extra weight on you.

Yea I noticed this trend too. How people relate vegetarians to being thin.

One of my friend wanted to lose weight and the first thing she said was "I'm going to be a vegetarians".

Originally Posted by jo87

• REDUCE HEART DISEASE
  Beans, peas, nuts and seeds contain little to no saturated fats. Reducing saturated fats can help keep your cholesterol low, and cut risk of cardiovascular disease.
• LIMIT CANCER RISK
  Hundreds of studies suggest that diets high in fruits and vegetables can reduce cancer risk. Red meat consumption is associated with colon cancer.
• FIGHT DIABETES
  Research suggests that plant-based diets – particularly those low in processed meat – can reduce your risk of type 2 diabetes.
• CURB OBESITY
  People on low-meat or vegetarian diets have significantly lower body weights and body mass indices. A plant-based diet is a great source of fiber (absent in animal products). This makes you feel full with fewer calories, ie. lower calorie intake and less overeating.
• LIVE LONGER
  Red and processed meat consumption is associated with increases in total mortality, cancer mortality and cardiovascular disease mortality.
• IMPROVE YOUR DIET
  Consuming beans or peas results in higher intakes of fiber, protein, folate, zinc, iron and magnesium with lower intakes of saturated fat and total fat.

Wtf is all this? Propaganda? Seriously have you people ever heard of a thing called moderation? People have been surviving on meat for many years, and all of a sudden meat is going to kill you and give you cancer? No, people kill their bodies because they cant control their portions. Anything in excess is bad for you. Information like this is unacceptable in a university. Provide sources for all this information or remove it. Its an exactly credible to provide information on how bad meat is from a meatless monday website.Ugh. Besides the only reason meat in North America is bad is because we mass produce everything, we feed cows and pigs with chemicals so they grow faster. Obviously that will kill people sooner.

This information actually comes from meatlessmonday.com, feel free to check out the website and take a look at the reasons behind the campaign. The post really wasn't intended to come off as propaganda, but rather to just outline the reasons why reducing meat consumption overall can be beneficial. The Mac Veggie Club is accepting of everyone's dietary choices, and the members of the club aren't trying to convert anyone. We respect everyone's choices, we are just trying to educate people about vegetarianism and to debunk myths surrounding vegetarians and the vegetarian lifestyle. If you have any concerns about the campaign, please email us at [email protected] om or stop by and talk to us in the student centre on any of the days outlined in the original post.

While the original poster emphasized the benefits of being a vegetarian/vegan, it's not like they ever said "if you eat meat, you're going to get cancer, have a heart attack, and die." They simply stated the fact that these risks are lowered, or at least are thought to be, by a vegetarian diet. Everything they said was relatively common knowledge. What harm is there in broadcasting better health opportunities?

That's always how these things go. If someone talks about vegetarianism, someone who isn't a vegetarian is going to go on the defensive and say things are being shoved down their throat. Similarly, I recall being pissed off when people claimed vegetarianism/veganism is "stupid" (that's the scientific evidence against it, apparently) when I was a vegan.

tl;dr: The OP never said "if you eat meat, you're f***ed."

Originally Posted by Mowicz

The only reason I brought it up is because I think vegetarian (and related) organizations generally have this type of problem.

As an example, PETA has completely turned me off of the whole concept mentioned above (the animals are living creatures and we shouldn't eat them thing). I try to keep an open mind when it comes to different philosophies, but I can't help but look at the people preaching and see if I have any reason to listen to them in the first place. In PETA's case, there have been many examples of vigilante justice, and a lot of the funds they raise go to court costs and bail. Without even looking at their philosophy itself, I can't sympathize with a group like that.

While the initiative is fine in principle, I don't want you guys to inadvertantly come off the wrong way...that's all. And not to compare you to PETA or anything, just a fitting example.

I can agree with this. Generally, PETA movements are over the top. I just don't think this was preaching.

Greenpeace is pretty bad too, sometimes.

Originally Posted by Mowicz

The only reason I brought it up is because I think vegetarian (and related) organizations generally have this type of problem.

As an example, PETA has completely turned me off of the whole concept mentioned above (the animals are living creatures and we shouldn't eat them thing). I try to keep an open mind when it comes to different philosophies, but I can't help but look at the people preaching and see if I have any reason to listen to them in the first place. In PETA's case, there have been many examples of vigilante justice, and a lot of the funds they raise go to court costs and bail. Without even looking at their philosophy itself, I can't sympathize with a group like that.

While the initiative is fine in principle, I don't want you guys to inadvertantly come off the wrong way...that's all. And not to compare you to PETA or anything, just a fitting example.

[email protected] PETA thinking they're legitimate.

If PETA was the only exposure anyone ever had about animal welfare/ vegetarianism, we'd all be meat eaters.

Originally Posted by AM320

If you have any concerns about the campaign, please email us at [email protected] om or stop by and talk to us in the student centre on any of the days outlined in the original post.

Why couldn't the representative come _here_ instead and be active on MI in a thread that is relevant to the campaign?

Don't take it to personal email. I am curious about the questions and answers people have!

Originally Posted by PHLN

Why couldn't the representative come _here_ instead and be active on MI in a thread that is relevant to the campaign?

Don't take it to personal email. I am curious about the questions and answers people have!

It's MacInsiders - it would turn into a massive argument with an actual intelligent/good point being brought up every 20 posts, between memes and troll posts.