Perhaps they should look into getting strippers. After all, isn't sex supposed to sell?

Honestly though I don't think they should serve alcoholic drinks. The focus should be strictly on making GOOD food, or rent out the place to people who can (non-corporate).

a campus bar that does not sell alcohol?...lol?

Originally Posted by Phoenix

a campus bar that does not sell alcohol?...lol?

My point exactly, there shouldn't be a division of bars into graduate and undergraduate. Why segregate students along such lines?

I don't know how well the Phoenix has been doing but I'd assume that it is not as bad as Quarters, or else there would have been discussion about it. The Phoenix is located in a better area (above ground) and can be the campus bar/pub.

Quarters should just become another area to buy food, hopefully some that is of quality (i.e. one that has souvlaki).

Just my 2 cents!

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong with anything I say in this post:

Quarters is a service provided by the MSU, Phoenix is not. Therefore I don't think Phoenix can be the only campus bar. Plus what happens on club nights at Q's? They don't serve alcohol? That's stupid. The alcohol at Q's is much cheaper than Phoenix.

Location wise, I enjoy not having to brave the cold in the winter to get into Phoenix. Quarters being in the MUSC basement helps because the entire Arts Quad is connected to it, and the space that they have accomodates both dancefloor and food. Phoenix is more of a bar which is fine in its own respect but if someone wanted to go dance on a Thursday night AND drink then Phoenix isn't the place.

Does anyone know what's happening to Phoenix once Wentworth House is demo'd?

Originally Posted by DavidR

Does anyone know what's happening to Phoenix once Wentworth House is demo'd?

I know there were talks of it being put above Bridges, at one point but I don't know if that still stands.

People who are complaining about real IDs being turned away cannot be the same people who complain that underagers get in. Its a case with just about any bar I have been to. Sometimes people get turned away. If we were suddenly instilling an atmosphere where bouncers are giving people the benefit of the doubt, suddenly we'll have more people with fake IDs.

As for the separate line for 18-year-olds, are we suddenly giving some special preference to underage students now? Half the time underage students line up at 9:30, and the other half they show up at 11 thinking they can walk down the stairs and into the back door, get stopped, and then complain later, or call someone else to try to get them in. Where is the equity for the students who have to wait in the normal line, or are we going to start a system where you get to go in where your number gets called?

Matt for all your cynical views on the intelligence of bouncers, you have come up with a pretty stupid idea.

The real solution here is that if you are underage, you have no reason to be sitting and predrinking (because it's illegal), so get in line at 9:30. If the first 50 people into Quarters are underage consistently, then there is no need for someone to show up at 10:30, standing in the line near Timmys, expecting to get in. It's cut and dry. Show up early, or don't get in at all. Quarters is open 6 days a week, and 5 of those are true all ages nights, but if under age first years are going on about how they can't get in on a Thursday, it is not the primary concern of anyone.

I've spent my time outside of bars because I was not of age, countless friends of mine have been in that situation, and countless others across Canada and the US have and do. There is no reason that the new breed of first-years cannot wait until they turn 19 before they got to Quarters on a Thursday.

Underagers on a Thursday is a liability to Quarters, and to the MSU, and they need to understand this. I have seen far too many instances of people with wristbands and Xs on their hands making fools out of themselves because they were too drunk. It is not a right, it is a privilege. Once you turn 19, things change, and that is the point in time when you can start complaining about not being allowed in.

Originally Posted by deadpool

People who are complaining about real IDs being turned away cannot be the same people who complain that underagers get in. Its a case with just about any bar I have been to. Sometimes people get turned away. If we were suddenly instilling an atmosphere where bouncers are giving people the benefit of the doubt, suddenly we'll have more people with fake IDs.

As for the separate line for 18-year-olds, are we suddenly giving some special preference to underage students now? Half the time underage students line up at 9:30, and the other half they show up at 11 thinking they can walk down the stairs and into the back door, get stopped, and then complain later, or call someone else to try to get them in. Where is the equity for the students who have to wait in the normal line, or are we going to start a system where you get to go in where your number gets called?

Matt for all your cynical views on the intelligence of bouncers, you have come up with a pretty stupid idea.

The real solution here is that if you are underage, you have no reason to be sitting and predrinking (because it's illegal), so get in line at 9:30. If the first 50 people into Quarters are underage consistently, then there is no need for someone to show up at 10:30, standing in the line near Timmys, expecting to get in. It's cut and dry. Show up early, or don't get in at all. Quarters is open 6 days a week, and 5 of those are true all ages nights, but if under age first years are going on about how they can't get in on a Thursday, it is not the primary concern of anyone.

I've spent my time outside of bars because I was not of age, countless friends of mine have been in that situation, and countless others across Canada and the US have and do. There is no reason that the new breed of first-years cannot wait until they turn 19 before they got to Quarters on a Thursday.

Underagers on a Thursday is a liability to Quarters, and to the MSU, and they need to understand this. I have seen far too many instances of people with wristbands and Xs on their hands making fools out of themselves because they were too drunk. It is not a right, it is a privilege. Once you turn 19, things change, and that is the point in time when you can start complaining about not being allowed in.

Having been at this university for two years, I've seen/experienced both.

You make a very very valid point, but try explaining that to the first years who are under 19. The illegality of predrinking is not going to stop them, ever. The illegality of a fake ID so they can go to any number of bars/clubs in Hamilton is not going to stop them. While we have laws and rules, these are not exactly strictly enforced. Not everyone displays the level of maturity that you expect of them, as is clear from your post, and so you have to make rules based on that.

Well my point is, we don't make special concessions for first years at the expense of everyone else. The system is decent right now, and people just need to stop complaining about it.

Originally Posted by deadpool

Well my point is, we don't make special concessions for first years at the expense of everyone else. The system is decent right now, and people just need to stop complaining about it.

I agree, in the general sense, all these ideas about extra lines, changing the bypass, this that and the other, in my opinion won't work. Changing quarters to Study space, or anything like that is kinda silly, in my opinion. The lack of study space on campus is another issue, but that also has to do with the lack of power outlets in places. On 4th floor mills in the big room, I think like 10 people can have laptops based on the plug space. BUT, thats another story.

I think changes at Quarters need to be realistic, and at least for now in the starting stages, smaller. You can't just turn the establishment on its head on the first day.

Quarters is the Campus Club (which also runs as a Bar some nights), Phoenix is a Campus Bar.

Quarters is run by the MSU (Which is a Corporation), Phoenix is run by the GSA (the MSU of *some* Grad Students – MBA Students have their own Association).

As for fake IDs, if the Bouncer suspects a fake they can always ask for another piece of ID. I know I once had my DND ID turned away so I used my drivers’ license with no trouble.

A Club that doesn’t sell alcohol is one that goes out of business. The fact that students pre-drink shows that they want to go out and drink.

There were discussions about Bridges; however, I doubt it will happen due to the proximity to Wally. The noise from the Phoenix patio, if said patio was right next to an all girls residence, wouldn’t fly. This was one of the main points in opposition to Phoenix being moved to the Refectory.

I waited until I was 19 before I ever went to Quarters (unless you count a few all ages events held there by the IRC & my faculty). I don’t think you should attribute self-prohibition until 19 as a sign of maturity. If you do, then a 17 year old European can be “mature” while legally drinking in Europe while a 20 year old American is “immature” when he drinks since the legal drinking age in the States is 21. If anything, write your MPP and demand a lower drinking age.

For all my cynical views of the bar, at least I'm trying to go through the proper channels to change things. I'm not saying that everything is fine when clearly it isn't. A bar doesn't lose close to half a million dollars and say everything is "fine". I frequent quarters on a regular basis, and am speaking on behalf of those who have given their two cents. Not all of us have the luxury of eluding cover, knowing the bartenders, drinking for free or getting special privileges. I'm not playing the whole underdog card, but as an SRA member I have to speak for the faculty of engineering.

So I haven't been paying attention to this thread recently, for various reasons, but I just have to say that I went to Quarters today for lunch and if you haven't had the Turkey Pesto GET OFF YOUR ARSE AND GO!


nom nom-tastic

No one gets drinks for free, and define 'special privileges'. Knowing the bartenders? what does that get you? NOTHING, they don't pour you free drinks or anything like that. I have friends that are bartenders and I pay full price for my drinks. Bartenders at Q's are friendly and easily approachable for a conversation. The cover issue has already been talked about earlier in this thread or another thread. This isnt an attack on you Matt but I'm just pointing stuff out

Originally Posted by Matt Wright

For all my cynical views of the bar, at least I'm trying to go through the proper channels to change things. I'm not saying that everything is fine when clearly it isn't. A bar doesn't lose close to half a million dollars and say everything is "fine". I frequent quarters on a regular basis, and am speaking on behalf of those who have given their two cents. Not all of us have the luxury of eluding cover, knowing the bartenders, drinking for free or getting special privileges. I'm not playing the whole underdog card, but as an SRA member I have to speak for the faculty of engineering.

Matt, I have fond memories of the time a friend of mine tried to use Vishal Tiwari's courtesy card to try to (unsuccesfully) bypass the line at Quarters, and of the time that a friend of mine felt that he could take advantage of the line bypass that I receive as an MSU employee! I really do hope you also treasure these memories; we seem to no longer have fun like that. Allthough, it might be that you got a courtesy card of your own to bypass all those in the Faculty of Engineering you speak for.

Nevertheless, what I said had nothing to do with the Faculty of Engineering nor does it have to do special privileges given to MSU employees. I solely talk about the merits of letting underage students in, and how the AGCO would be more than happy to settle that matter by ending the liquor license in our establishment.