just a quick question... are the picketers legally allowed to block entrances to campus? :S ....

that's VERY weird ... they should be able to picket as long as they don't ruin other people's lives :S

Originally Posted by EngLufLuf

just a quick question... are the picketers legally allowed to block entrances to campus? :S ....

that's VERY weird ... they should be able to picket as long as they don't ruin other people's lives :S

Yeah, they are. That much I know. Although there are rules and regulations for how many cars per minute and how far back a line-up can go. For example, this morning on Cootes Dr. Southbound, because the line-up exceeded the length deemed safe by the police they were required to(and consequently did) let in a fair amount of cars.

As far as I know, the picketers are being reasonable about how many cars they are letting through and are in now way pushing the limits set in the law.

Originally Posted by EngLufLuf

They should be able to picket as long as they don't ruin other people's lives :S

And you've pointed out another one of the main problems with unions and strikes. They cause a lot of collatoral damage, which the organizations involved don't seem to care about at all. It's something that needs to change, and reforms need to be put in place by the government to protect the public from the actions of both unions (in the case of strikes) and employers (in the case of lock-outs).

Originally Posted by EngLufLuf

just a quick question... are the picketers legally allowed to block entrances to campus? :S ....

that's VERY weird ... they should be able to picket as long as they don't ruin other people's lives :S

Legally the university doesn't have to let them on campus to block cars.

However they could just block the side walks indefinitely. I'm sure however if that this would make the traffic congestion worse.

At that point the University would likely half to seek an injunction to prevent them from doing it.

Civil courts have stated that picketing is unlawful if it interferes with the rights of entrance or exit from private property. Picketers may not lawfully engage in the following activity:
Stopping vehicles entering/exiting the struck premises for unreasonable lengths of time;
Blocking roadways that lead to the premises;
Limiting access or egress to the struck premises; or
Making threats or engaging in intimidation.
In summary, picketing that blocks or obstructs access to the struck premises is unlawful and has never been condoned by the courts.

This is from Peel Regional Police's website.

From further reading their site the protestors would be allowed to block only long enough to offer literature, and the police could order them to stop if they cause too much of a backup in the community.

That said, the University signed away any potential to limit the delay in the picketing protocol they agreed to, presumably in order to prevent ugly PR damaging confrontations.

Unions in Hamilton tend to get rough (Witness the occupation of a credit union branch by COPE and some supporting members of Hamilton's umbrella group for unions that only ended with the police having to forcefully remove the protestors).

My theory is that McMaster doesn't want to have Campus Security seen arresting and forcibly removing protestors, as this would ruin their reputation and would likely cause other Hamilton union members to come down and make a bigger disruption.

By the way the Peel regional police also state that you are legally obligated to allow the picketers to obstruct you indefinitely or request the police assist you. Apparently, the law does not allow you in any form of transportation to force your way through a picket line, even if you are being blockaded illegally or in violation of a picketing protocol.

Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer, but this appears to be what the Peel Police state is the law in Ontario.

Originally Posted by arathbon

By the way the Peel regional police also state that you are legally obligated to allow the picketers to obstruct you indefinitely or request the police assist you. Apparently, the law does not allow you in any form of transportation to force your way through a picket line, even if you are being blockaded illegally or in violation of a picketing protocol.

Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer, but this appears to be what the Peel Police state is the law in Ontario.

This makes perfect sense though... vigilantes are almost never legally tolerated.

Originally Posted by Taunton

This makes perfect sense though... vigilantes are almost never legally tolerated.

Actually legally there are rules that give powers to private citizens strictly limited power to enforce the law the main one being citizen's arrest. However they are not set up clearly and depending on who the crown prosecutor is, you may find yourself in trouble. There's a shopowner in toronto who found this out recently, when the police and crowns wanted to charge him with among other things Kidnapping and Forcible Confinement for making a citizen's arrest, because they claim that since the criminal in question was not committing the crime at the very moment he was arrested by the shopowner he victimized it was not a citizen's arrest. In fact, they gave the thief a plea bargain in exchange for testimony against his victim.

Originally Posted by Taunton

This makes perfect sense though... vigilantes are almost never legally tolerated.

Also the scary part is you have to hope the police are willing to look bad on camera. Witness the fact that police have refused to enforce court ordered injunctions when it stood to create bad publicity.

Originally Posted by arathbon

Actually legally there are rules that give powers to private citizens strictly limited power to enforce the law the main one being citizen's arrest. However they are not set up clearly and depending on who the crown prosecutor is, you may find yourself in trouble. There's a shopowner in toronto who found this out recently, when the police and crowns wanted to charge him with among other things Kidnapping and Forcible Confinement for making a citizen's arrest, because they claim that since the criminal in question was not committing the crime at the very moment he was arrested by the shopowner he victimized it was not a citizen's arrest. In fact, they gave the thief a plea bargain in exchange for testimony against his victim.

Thanks. I know about citizens arrests... what I'm referring to is true vigilanteism (ie not following prescribed laws such as those surrounding the citizens arrest in order to detain or punish one who is percieved to be breaking the law).

In other words, assaulting a picketer because they held you past the legal time of 5 minutes is not acceptable, (even though the picketer's actions are illegal) and it's your responsibility to ask the police for help.

I saw some DUMBASS picketer today with their dog on the picket lines. It was SO cold, windy and rainy. It was a beagle so it had really short fur; he had to have been so cold.
A strike is a pretty stressful situation, why would you bring an animal into this? Also, if someone tried to drive through the barrier yesterday, why would you risk your pet's safety like that?

I went up to the people on the side and asked to talk to someone who was in charge. I told him it was was too cold for the dog to be outside, especially for hours on end. He was very nice about it; I hope he talked to the woman.

Originally Posted by Kathy2

I saw some DUMBASS picketer today with their dog on the picket lines. It was SO cold, windy and rainy. It was a beagle so it had really short fur; he had to have been so cold.
A strike is a pretty stressful situation, why would you bring an animal into this? Also, if someone tried to drive through the barrier yesterday, why would you risk your pet's safety like that?

I went up to the people on the side and asked to talk to someone who was in charge. I told him it was was too cold for the dog to be outside, especially for hours on end. He was very nice about it; I hope he talked to the woman.

That was very mature of you, if you don't mind me saying. There are some hotheads out there that would've used it as an excuse for a fight.

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As I've stated in a couple other threads: It is illegal to block pedestrian traffic. The picketers are staying within the law and when asked by the police officers stationed at each entrance to alter their behaviour, they have more been more then willing to comply with their orders.