Yeah, it's fine in the summer, it's just a pain in the ass during the winter time when there's tons of people on campus, it's -15 and there's ice and snow everywhere. Especially after a 4:30 class, I want to get the hell out of there haha.

Originally Posted by ViktorVaughn

Regardless of whose fault it may be, the end result is the same - moving the bus routes will reduce accidents on campus.

And is walking half-way across campus really that big of a deal? Some people walk here and back from home 30 or 40 minutes multiple times a day. Outside air and a nice walk aren't as terrible as they sound.

I've walked a total of 50 minutes so far, and I still have to go back later for two other classes. Wouldn't be so bad if my shoes weren't so worn out. I needs me a foot rub. D:

Originally Posted by ViktorVaughn

Regardless of whose fault it may be, the end result is the same - moving the bus routes will reduce accidents on campus.

And is walking half-way across campus really that big of a deal? Some people walk here and back from home 30 or 40 minutes multiple times a day. Outside air and a nice walk aren't as terrible as they sound.

There haven't really been that many, have there? One Art-Sci that I can recall, and she didn't even die. I'm sure that there may be more but really, it's not a big enough issue as to get this kind of attention. There are probably more bicycle vs pedestrian incidents possibly even more serious than the bus accidents overall, but nobody is talking about banning bikes from the campus.

Banning bikes, losing the streets to all service vehicles, and mowing the lawns by hand would eliminate accidents, but given the terrible imbalance of cost and gain it's not done. Similar things could be said for the HSR routing issue.

For my money, the routing has little to do with safety and much to do with the university taking its ball and going home over the Westdale dump truck hullabaloo. I'm not alone in feeling this way. The misdirection going on over the HSR re-routing proposals reminds one of way back when the shuttle busses were routed off of central campus. The MSU prez posed for a terrific picture beside a brand-new "Closed to Motor Traffic" sign for a Silhouette piece on how this greatly improved pedestrian safety, but in fact (and it is a fact) the move was done to reduce fuel costs for McMaster. Hopefully common sense will prevail in this current issue and the status quo will be maintained, since it's at least mostly acceptable for most of us.

Originally Posted by ViktorVaughn

Regardless of whose fault it may be, the end result is the same - moving the bus routes will reduce accidents on campus.

And is walking half-way across campus really that big of a deal? Some people walk here and back from home 30 or 40 minutes multiple times a day. Outside air and a nice walk aren't as terrible as they sound.

By that argument, we should get rid of all roads, it reduces accidents. I prefer the usefulness of the bus thank you. And lets see how you like it having to walk that in the winter. Or in the sun today, getting your face burnt(I had to walk it today because my bus was gonna take half an hour and I was in a rush).

If the buses are moved off campus, it`ll probably be diverted to the edge of campus - like near the hospital.

Considering that`s only a 5 minute walk from the regular bus stop, it`s not that big of a deal. It might reduce the number of people who take the bus from university to sterling.

Then again, I`ve been told that a 20 minute walk from campus is far. Students can be so lazy sometimes.

Originally Posted by Jay

If the buses are moved off campus, it`ll probably be diverted to the edge of campus - like near the hospital.

Considering that`s only a 5 minute walk from the regular bus stop, it`s not that big of a deal. It might reduce the number of people who take the bus from university to sterling.

Then again, I`ve been told that a 20 minute walk from campus is far. Students can be so lazy sometimes.

It's far when it's 4 times a day, you've got shitty shoes, and when there's gonna be two feet of snow soon.

Why is it automatically laziness that comes to your mind?

Originally Posted by Jay

Students can be so lazy sometimes.

Yes, but we can also be very tired. It wouldn't kill us to walk more, but having the bus go through campus is just one convenience that makes things a bit more bearable.

Also, there are currently four or five stops for each bus (depending on the route) going east through campus, and a similar number going west. Imagine what would happen if they were condensed to a small area around the hospital. It can be engineered wonderfully, but the fact remains that there isn't very much room to move up there. It would be a mess even when optimized, as compared to the current arrangement. This would contribute one more reason for me to not return for grad studies (on top of the mess that's been made of parking, the libraries, course and test scheduling, study space, and several administration issues which are climbing on my pet-peeve degree index), similarly for other students I'd imagine.

Facing declining enrollment in several departments, how many drudgeries more can the University impose upon us before the bottom line begins to suffer?

Originally Posted by lawleypop

It's far when it's 4 times a day, you've got shitty shoes, and when there's gonna be two feet of snow soon.

Why is it automatically laziness that comes to your mind?

It's 5 minutes of walking from the Sterling Bus Stop to the hospital. That's less than walking from ITB to CNH or even Bates to MUSC. It's not a big deal at all.

I walk to campus during the winter (20 minutes one-way), so it's definitely possible for students to catch the bus at a different bus stop. For most students, it is a matter of laziness. No wonder why there's a problem with obesity and poor physical fitness.

Well I mean, if buses are moved off completely, aren't we just diverting students to like... actual traffic on Main St and other places? I remember when I was in high school, our school was on the main street (like one of the major streets in Toronto), and teachers were always telling us to be careful because students would get hit. So I really don't understand what the difference would be.

Originally Posted by feonateresa

Well I mean, if buses are moved off completely, aren't we just diverting students to like... actual traffic on Main St and other places? I remember when I was in high school, our school was on the main street (like one of the major streets in Toronto), and teachers were always telling us to be careful because students would get hit. So I really don't understand what the difference would be.

The difference is that it wouldn't be McMaster's problem.

McMaster University: pedestrian friendly, so long as you're on our property. And screw transit.

speaking of getting hit, almost always when i cross at main I get someone that tries to go right and almost hits me. And the thing is that they're not supposed to turn right on red, but they do it anyway.

Originally Posted by MarkA

The difference is that it wouldn't be McMaster's problem.

McMaster University: pedestrian friendly, so long as you're on our property. And screw transit.

So basically, if in a few years the buses are moved off completely and people are getting hit on Main St, don't you think people would ask why they were moved off-campus in the first place? It brings unnecessary heat to the university.

Originally Posted by Jay

It's 5 minutes of walking from the Sterling Bus Stop to the hospital. That's less than walking from ITB to CNH or even Bates to MUSC. It's not a big deal at all.

I walk to campus during the winter (20 minutes one-way), so it's definitely possible for students to catch the bus at a different bus stop. For most students, it is a matter of laziness. No wonder why there's a problem with obesity and poor physical fitness.

The problem is that students are effing busy and sometimes the extra ten minutes I can save by catching a bus outside my classroom as opposed to across the campus on main street can mean getting to work on time as opposed to being late.

It makes everything less efficient. It's not laziness, it's a requirement for speed and efficiency.

Also, as previously mentioned by others, moving the buses off-campus exposes more pedestrians to heavy traffic on off-campus roads. This is a huge fail, because it will inevitably lead to more traffic accidents and hit pedestrians.

you guize, I've said it before and I'll say it now, why don't we start a movement of some kind.
EDIT: Just emailed engineering caucus leader. Awaiting some response

Well, the MSU has been working with the University and HSR since they started this "get the buses off campus" thing... VP Admin Andrew Richardson has been working on this for more than a year. It's definitely a work in progress... it's not like we aren't doing anything though. I'm just not sure what else there is for us to do within professional diplomatic channels.